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Subject: Support for the IOC 2.0 checklist
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ulrand User is Offline Posts:4 Occasional Poster
03/24/2009 4:00 AM Alert 

It seems rather likely that the work by the IOC (see http://worldbirdnames.org/names.html) will become the new world list of choice for international birders - at least outside North America.

Are there any plans for Birder's Diary to support the IOC list any time soon?

Thank you.

Ulrik Andersen

 

 

 

SteveO User is Offline Posts:509 Veteran Member
03/24/2009 4:41 PM Alert 

As the creator of several of the tax lists on BD, I asked Jeff that question several months ago, but at that time there was no interest.

After Jeff got a couple queries in the last couple months, I started work - before i got slightly sidetracked.

I hope to get back on track in the near future.

So, yes, it is coming. No schedule yet, because there are always a few taxonomic unknowns.


Regards,
Steve
Vireo User is Offline Posts:56 Veteran Member
06/01/2009 12:35 PM Alert 

Let me add my support for adding this taxonomic list to BD. Clements is now quite up to date for the Western Hemisphere, but it is hopelessly (?) out of date for the rest of the world. It would be great if this taxonomy could become an option in BD.

Nick Brickle User is Offline Posts:1 Occasional Poster
07/17/2009 1:06 AM Alert 
I'll add my support too. I do most of my birding in south-east asia and the IOC list is definitely more up-to-date. It would be great if BirdersDiary supported it. I'd buy it!

Nick
SteveO User is Offline Posts:509 Veteran Member
07/17/2009 8:00 AM Alert 

The time required to create a new list is directly related to one of the great strengths of Birder's Diary - the ability to use different Tax lists and have your personal lists and counts still be accurate.

This requires that each entry on each list be mapped to the correct underlying taxon, so that, for example, the American Robin sighting recorded using the ABA list will be shown as an American Robin if you use the Wells list, the AOU list, the BOU list, the Western Palearctic list, the Clements list, etc. It also required that if the Americal Robin is added to the AOU SACC list, the entry must point to the same underlying taxon.

And it is fairly easy for most of the entries in a list.- although there might be issues with the fact that Clements lists seven subspecies. 

It gets more interesting when a species is split or lumped. If a species is split, the new entry generally must be set to use an existing taxon, usually a named subspecies of the species from which it was split - but not always.  And in the case of the American Robin, the Clements and Howard & Moore lists show the same seven subspecies (not always the case) but Wells and Sibley list only the nominate and the San Lucan (T. m. confinis)  

And a new list always raises new questions - especially if the new list uses different names and has a tendency to split - like the IOC.

That being said - work is progressing.

By the way, Nick - The only OBC Checklist that I can find on the web is at the OBC website, but is dated 2001. Is there a later version anywhere?


Regards,
Steve
ulrand User is Offline Posts:4 Occasional Poster
07/21/2011 12:10 PM Alert 
This is now two years ago - will we see the results of the work in progress any time soon?
Clements seems more and more irrelevant....

Thank you.

Ulrik
jjones User is Offline Posts:5092 Veteran Member
07/21/2011 12:37 PM Alert 

Hello Ulrik,

It is in progress. The creator of the IOC checklist is waiting on some needed new functionality from me in order to complete his changes.

However, and just for my knowledge, I don't understand the statement that "Clements seems more and more irrelevant". To my understanding, it is stil the de facto standard for birds of the world. It has the weight of the Cornell Lab of Ornithology behind it. What makes it seem irrelevant to you?

Thanks,

Jeff


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SteveO User is Offline Posts:509 Veteran Member
07/23/2011 12:27 PM Alert 
However, and just for my knowledge, I don't understand the statement that "Clements seems more and more irrelevant". To my understanding, it is stil the de facto standard for birds of the world. It has the weight of the Cornell Lab of Ornithology behind it. What makes it seem irrelevant to you?
On p. 12 of the July issue of Birding - the ABA's magazine - there is a letter to the editor titled "Which World Checklist". In this piece, the writer softly advocates for the ABA adopting the IOC list and lists several reasons, which I will not retype. It will be interesting to see if there are opposing or supportive letters in future editionss of Birding.

Until recently there were only two World lists with subspecies, Howard and Moore - which provided infrequent editions and no revisions in between, and Clements - which provided annual updates, with perhaps less scientific rigour.

The IOC list - with subspecies - is a promising addition to the field. In comparison to Clements, it offers more frequent updates, a more liberal view on splits i.e. less stability, the listing of author names and dates, and a view of the avifauna of areas under-represented by major checklist committees (AOU, BOU, RAOU). In comparison to H&M, it currently offers much more frequent updates and a much larger web presence.

I am not sure I would label Clements as irrelevant, but the brand suffered after Jim Clements' death. Tom Schulenberg and the Cornell/eBird team are working to rebuild it.

If nothing else, the addition of a third World list gives birders one more thing to discuss.

Regards,
Steve
Roaminoz User is Offline Posts:45 Veteran Member
11/26/2011 2:42 AM Alert 
I would like to add my support for this taxonomic list too.
Our Aussie list is way behind the eight ball and appears to be only updated every 10 plus years.
Jude
jjones User is Offline Posts:5092 Veteran Member
11/26/2011 10:04 AM Alert 

This is coming. I apologize for the long delay. These things are complicated to reconcile differences between two World lists.

Stay tuned.

Jeff


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